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May I ask what those advantages might be? As someone who likes to bring lessons from the gym to real life, I feel like being 26 in the gym isnt too bad. However, being 26 and working to be a doctor when all my classmates are 21 and below does ride hard on me.

Hi everyone, I'm very new to Muay Thai. I've been training it 2-3 times per week for a little over 4 months. I'm 42 years old, and I've never trained any martial art or fighting sport before; when I was younger I did things like tennis, running, and cycling and in recent years I've just been doing general fitness stuff. I'm training at a Muay Thai/Boxing/Jiu Jitsu gym that just opened at the beginning of the year. I like the owners of the gym a lot. I signed up for Muay Thai after meeting the coach with whom the gym contracted to teach at an open house the gym hosted. He has a very magnetic personality and his emphasis on the technical aspects of the sport really appealed to me. I probably would not have made it through the first couple of weeks if he hadn't been encouraging and tolerant of my slow pace of learning. I would get really anxious before every class, but that's gradually going away. Unfortunately, the coach recently and suddenly severed his relationship with the gym. I suspect that he may have just been spreading himself too thin, because he has a large family and another coaching gig in another city, but I don't know for sure. The whole thing feels really weird because the suddenness of the separation didn't seem to fit with what I perceived to be the coach's character. The gym is working on finding a replacement coach, and until then has had people of varying skill levels and backgrounds teaching classes. The classes haven't been very focused on the technical aspects of the sport and are more conditioning-oriented. For the moment I'm willing to wait it out until they come up with something more consistent. As I said above, I really like the owners and I think they are trying hard to figure out something to meet their students' needs, but it takes time. At this point I'm feeling that if I want to continue to learn Muay Thai, my motivation is going to have to come from myself and not from a coach, and that the coach-student relationship is one that is often fleeting. I have to keep telling myself that teachers will come and go and I'm just going to have to account for that in my learning process. I guess my question for the group is whether this sort of thing is common, or if anyone else has gone through something like this in their Muay Thai learning experience. If a coach that you like left, how did you deal with that? How did you keep going? If you learn from different people at the same time, how do you keep it all consistent for yourself?

I just watched the fight video with the voice over commentary. ( I saw it live too. I missed the 1st round live but saw it from 2nd round middle on) congratulations!! ( no further comments Bc I’ve only been doing MT for 5 months so I have no real insight or in-depth knowledge. I just enjoy watching and listening. And learning if im luck enough) who is the other fighter that is on here that you said fought really well even though it was her 2nd fight only? Congrats to her also.

I’m going to quote Sean Fagan the Muay Thai guy here and say very loudly and with a frown “ FUCK NO you’re NOT TOO OLD!!!!!! ” lol. Sean Fagan cracks me up. ( he’s very serious about muay thai but he acts goofy on occasion for fun and I love that. Life’s hard. Muay Thai is hard. Ya gotta laugh when you can imho ) also PLEASE anyone who has any thought in their head they may be ‘too old’ for Muay Thai and especially for fighting - watch this video!!! also TO ADMIN HERE : can I please punch anyone in the face who is ONLY 35 ( still young!) who calls themselves old? Is that allowed??? just kidding. Sorta. seriously watch this video https://www.muay-thai-guy.com/blog/muay-thai-mondays-how-old-is-too-old-to-start-fighting

I can’t LOVE your reply and these facts/videos you shared any more. Just awesome. Thank you.

I’m just now seeing this! The advantages are that most people have a bit more humility and understand their challenges and limitations as well as their strengths. Not saying that this isn’t possible for younger people but for most, getting older means getting more grounded. And life experience helps to gain a bit of perspective, I think. Hard to explain until one experiences it.

if you had more fun in the one with more new people and more comfortable environment? Sounds like it would be a more enjoyable time training, and more likely to keep going back. But up to you.

Maybe you can record a video of your next class, for yourself, and do it again in 3 months, must be great if you can see their progress again, on video.

In terms of pragmatic thoughts on your sitch (not sure if useful): If it were me, I'd just hit the boxing classes hard and ask the owners if I could come early/stay behind to get some teep/Thai kick reps on the bags. As for your more general question: I only took up MT recently so my experience is hella limited, but I trained at a few gyms simultaneously before I committed to one. I also did PT with a few trainers from the gyms. I found two real gym options during this process. I had the most faith in the skills/style/badassery of the head trainer at one gym, but I felt most comfortable in the classes of another gym (this was because I just felt that gym had more n00bs, and the class had almost equal numbers of guys and galz which made me feel like I fit in a bit better). Ultimately, I had to figure out if it was more important for me to feel good about a trainer VS about the gym environment. (WARNING: At this point things get less and less relevant to your sitch for a little while..) In the end, I decided that my comfort/discomfort with the classes at the first gym was kind of a social anxiety thing (that's not quite what it was but kinda -- sort of like a performance anxiety/general social discomfort mish-mash). I also recognised that my fundamental interest in MT was absolutely about technical mastery and learning as much as possible as fast as possible. So I decided that the best path forward, if I could make it work/not be too avoidant due to my discomfort, would be to go with the gym/trainer who seemed totally world class compared to all the alternatives, and to just kinda force myself to get comfortable with those classes. I'm a few weeks in and still trying to do that last bit! But I think it was the right decision. (Okay, back to the point.) The reason I step this out in mind-numbing detail is just that I think everything, always, should come down to what your goals are and what you know about yourself. If my coach suddenly left his gym, I'd immediately reconsider where I was, and I'd look for the next best guy, because my training relationship with the coach is specifically about their perceived awesomeness, rather than any personal connection, so it kind of follows that I'd move on to the next without pause. If it had turned out that the gym was important to me, I'd definitely not do that. Finally, I think your conclusion about nurturing an intrinsic motivation rather than one based on an external relationship is really sound, and it seems like a good thing to realise early.

There are some other options for Muay Thai in my area. Some close, some not so close. I know the other place where the coach who left teaches, but it's too far out of the way; I think that may have had something to do with why he left my gym. Honestly, I'm not sure if I'd want to train with him again if I had the chance. Part of the reason I'm willing to give the gym some more time to figure things out is that the owners are kind of "family friend" acquaintances. My whole family actually signed up for Muay Thai as a show of support, but I don't think that everyone will be continuing with the current situation. You raise a good point about trying out another discipline while they sort out the Muay Thai situation. I've been thinking about doing that; maybe I should consider it more seriously. From what I understand the boxing and BJJ classes have been very consistent. Thanks for responding! It sounds like this situation isn't all that uncommon. Hopefully they'll sort things out.

Hi Brian. (Like you I started Muay Thai only 5 months ago and train 3x a week without exception) first- I don’t blame you. What a let down and disappointment. Of course Muay Thai is fun but the trainer can make it or break it. A ‘ work out & conditioning ‘ oriented class is just NOT the same as being taught by a charismatic ( you said magnetic personality) trainer who really knows his stuff and loves Muay Thai. I’m wondering if, while you wait to see who the gym hires permanently to replace him, you could research where else the original trainer teaches at as well as other Muay Thai gyms that are within in commuting distance. Is that possible or is it the only Muay Thai place in your area? it sounds like you are understanding of the gym owners situation but the fact is- you are currently NOT receiving what you signed up for and what you paid for. It’s an inferior product in a sense. ( it sounds like). I guess you need to decide how long you are willing to wait until there is a suitable and permanent replacement. ( 2 months? 6 months?) A similar thing happened to my son in tae kwon do he went consistently from around 2nd thru 4th grade- in total for about 2.5 years if my memory is correct. He ( we) were told he was 6 months away from a black belt. Then the trainer everyone loved was abruptly fired. Replacements came but the program wasn’t the same and no progress toward the black belt was ever given. Then the owner sold the business to a new guy. The new guy was great but did things differently and my son basically lost his ‘ ranking ’ ( I don’t know how to word it. He just was not close to earning a black belt anymore with the new owner) he lost interest. He Quit. We lost $. It was a very disappointing thing at the time. ( fast forward he’s big and now entering high school and discovered and loves Krav Maga so he does that. I’m happy for him though I wish he’d do Muay Thai with me ) do you by any chance have an interest in BJJ or boxing classes to tide you over until a Muay Thai teacher is hired? That’s just a thought. I’m just curious if you have other martial arts gyms that have Muay Thai near you? That might be the best option ... even if you ask for your membership to be put on hold until a new MT teacher is hired. Good luck. Don’t give up!

Update i just had another FUN muay thai class this am. I put all the above suggestions into place I got my thinking straight I thought to myself ‘his mood isnt my concern’ ‘Stay out of his head‘ ‘No over- thinking! No attempts to figure out what he’s thinking’ ( etc) my only job is to be an attentive student and try my best. Period! (I know I’ll still have bad Muay Thai classes occasionally Bc thats just life. But I’m going to seriously limit my overthinking ) thanks for letting me discuss it here and hearing me out. It helped.

You are so right AND I do understand it! and I’m going to put it into practice ( will everything be perfect from now on? No - we all know it won’t ) but this does help. thank you!!!!!

This is going to be one of those things that I say and you go, "oh yeah, totally," and then go right back to thinking the way you already think. That's okay. What we think is a habit. But I'm going to say it and I want you to try to really understand it: you do not make your trainer feel any way at all. Not good. Not bad. He feels how he feels because of the thoughts he's having and, in a room full of students, he's not thinking only - or even primarily - about you. Don't try to please him. Don't try to frustrate him. Neither are your responsibility. A few years ago my trainer was in this terrible mood. He walked through the room I was in, didn't acknowledge me at all, got in his car and left the gym. I was the only one there. He didn't train me. I had a fucking emotional breakdown, thinking I'd done something wrong and he was mad at me. I was obsessed with it and when I finally grew the courage to confront him about it, I realized it wasn't about me AT ALL. He was going through something very upsetting and instead of being compassionate, I was obsessing over myself. That taught me a lot. It's a relief, honestly.

This has already been covered pretty well above. One thing I would like to add though is: Don't forget you are the one paying for his service, not the other way around. His opinion doesn't count. He's there to teach you his knowledge, and you are probably paying a good amount for that knowledge. Imagine a cook or a waiter getting angry at you for not liking the food at a restaurant. You wouldn't take them seriously and would likely leave right? You aren't a professional fighter and the gym isn't getting a cut of your purse if you do fight. You sound like you are doing this form of martial arts because you enjoy it, and if you are paying for it, you should enjoy it. Maybe he was just having a rough day and carried it into the gym or something, but don't let his mood wear on you. Unless you are a sponsored fighter, he doesn't get to have expectations from you (other than adhering to gym rules obviously). Just do your best, you are still very very much a beginner. Good technique and flow comes slowly over time. Also, don't be afraid to ask questions if you don't understand something. A good coach can always get everyone else started and then come by to work with you on whatever you are struggling with. That's part of their job, and again, you are paying them for that. It's easy for the power dynamic between coaches and students to become unbalanced, and it sounds like that is a bit of what is happening. I'm not saying you need to leave the gym or anything, but don't be afraid of your hired help Get back in there and have some fun!

Omg I ***LOVE*** that mantra. Its exactly what I need! i like that you said ‘ people are allowed to feel shitty and be short with me’ ( even while you’re hypersensitivity in nature also) I think I needed to hear that! Thanks- great advise!!!

Yeah for sure it's confusing advice, the try not to try thing. Kinda like when people in real life generally say, "Oh just be more self-confident". In your head you're thinking...wait...how do you *just be* more self-confident if you're not self-confident? If you're not... then you don't yet know what it would feel like if you were...so you got no frame of reference... so how can you instantly give yourself that new feeling without knowing what it feels like? Seems like a damn minefield. So is trying to be relaxed if you're not relaxed. We probably make ourselves less relaxed in the attempt to be more relaxed. Back in the day the sax player Charlie Parker used to say it's good to learn techniques & theories etc, but when the times comes, it's more important to forget all that stuff and 'just play'. Not that music and sports are in any way similar - they're not, but it virtually every area of life you get real seasoned pros coming out with these sayings. Kinda pseudo-clever jedi mind trick expressions that they were told themselves by the masters when they were new and didn't understand. Until way down the road, when the understanding just happened to them after a hell of a lot of non-understanding. Actually talking of non understanding, all of the above sounded way more coherent when it was in my head.

Just keep the mantra "stay out of his head" and stop trying to read his thoughts. People are allowed to feel shitty and be short with me. I don't like it and I am hyper sensitive too. But don't use your adulthood as an excuse to call yourself the "worst" one etc. Those are thoughts I have and yes its harder for me to remember sometimes but I try and laugh it off with the coach - boo hoo I am old (beats the hell out of being dead). Its painful at times. I am older than you - its just a fact that my brain works sluggishly once in a while (and as a Mom of young kids - forget it - your RAM is nearly full all the time). So yeah as a person like you I say - stay out of his head, ask questions and if you really can't stand him go elsewhere. p.s. I am told women tend to want approval and to "belong" more when you coach them. Its nice if the coach knows this but he probably doesn't so you will either have to choose to dispense with that need or ask for more support or do what I do and just ride with it.

This is a poison of western fight culture. I've learned to never underestimate anybody. There's no such thing as an easy fight, really and truly. I was listening to Kru Nu tell me about how this opponent couldn't fight me, which is a Thai phrase that is often used to imply that skill levels are just crazy different. But even after telling me this, he paused and then told me never to underestimate anybody. He said anything can happen in a fight, it depends on how important it is to the other person, etc. I've felt that in my opponents. And I think that when your opponent is talked down - and people mean well when they do that, even though it's so shitty - it takes something from your own heart. It makes it seem less important. It allows you, even for a moment, even if you know better, to let your guard down a little. You SHOULD have an appropriate level of fear, or awareness, for every single person you will ever get in the ring with. Even if on paper it looks like there's no way you could lose. It's a fight. You've prepared for it. It's your preparation that will let you win, not your expectations about your opponent. You can fight anyone, Lisa. Literally anyone. You can be the one who everyone is down-talking and you can win in those conditions. Your opponent has the same possibilities. But don't doubt yourself or believe in yourself based on who or what your opponent is. Believe in yourself for what you've done, for who you are, for the work you've put in. None of that guarantees a win. But you can't disappoint yourself if you know you've done the work. Just do the work. The fight is part of it, not the result of it.

Hi and thanks @Matty. Think you hit a spot with your thoughts on my expectations. I must admit to myself that I expected to win (cringe!:)). I had seen her previously. People at my gym were boasting me saying it would be an easy win. I thought that my fear of the shame somehow would carry me through and make me win. (?!? I know this sounds ridiculous!!!) I thought that all my training would overpower the stage fright and adrenaline. So yeah I think that part of the shame also was that I and people around me expected me to win. I wasn’t better than the woman they had been down talking. I’m up for a second fight in a few weeks. I’ve been off and on whether I wanted to risk the shame again. But wtf! I don’t want to leave it like this. Having my first fight, not being happy with my performance, losing and hiding under the covers. I want to try it again and see if I can improve on not completely checking out mentally. And also this time around my expectations are different.

I think the shame you feel comes from your expectation of how you would perform, given that you had been able to perform well sparring with the guys at your gym. You know, I felt shame even when I won. Because there were things that I thought I should be able to do but couldn't. When I told that to my coach, he said that you will always feel that (having things you should be able to do/do better) unless you have a 1 second KO. In contrast, I had lost in an open tournament against an opponent with 10 fights when I had only 1 fight at the time. I was outmatched and got dominated the whole time. It was a tough beating to take. But I didn't feel shame. While I didn't go in expecting to lose, I didn't actually hold any expectation to win OR lose. It might be rare situation to never have expectations of yourself. What makes fighting beautiful is perhaps that dignity is on the line. But maybe while you feel shame, you may also remember pride at the same time. A CBT technique I have used is that I save screenshots of the fight of moments that made me feel proud, and whenever that feeling of shame rises up, I look at those screenshots to teach myself to recognize pride as well. Not to override shame, but to have both shame and pride at the same time (if you've watched cartoon movie "inside out", it's kinda at the end when Joy and Sadness both touch the memory ball). Kudos for having your first fight

I don't think 35 is too old at all! We've had people in their 40s join our team and fight for the first time and do really well. A lot of fighters stop by 35 because they've been doing it a long time and want something different or feel like they are slowing down. Part of that is the amount of wear and tear they have after training and fighting for more than 20 years though. They've been pounding on their body for decades. A vehicle made in 1983 with low miles will still run just fine

I've stopped thinking there's any such thing as being too old to do anything. Not out of my own experience obviously as I'm still only 28. But I keep seeing and hearing of people doing all kinds of incredible things at all kinds of ages. Here's Kru Rengrad (red short) one of my coach when I was at Lamnammoon's Muay Thai gym taking a fight in his 50s and smashing it (I don't remember exactly the date of that fight but it wasn't long ago): Also the oldest marathoner is, as far as we know, a man called Fauja Singh from East London who ran his last race at 101yo back in 2013 - and it appears that he didn't start young. (https://www.bbc.com/news/av/uk-21565970/oldest-marathon-runner-fauja-singh-s-final-race) I see no reason why you wouldn't shine.