Sylvie von Duuglas-Ittu

Both #6 (Wangchannoi) and #2 (Dieselnoi) defeated #1 (Samart). And Dieselnoi defeated Pudpadnoi as well, although both Pudpadnoi and Apidej are tricky because they're a generation (or 2) away from the bulk of the list, just a different era. I understand why Somrak is there, but he doesn't really belong on the list among those he shares the ranks with, just in terms of what his true accomplishments were as the first Gold Medalist in Boxing for Thailand. Says me, anyway. Kevin loves these kinds of lists, I don't, so it's not something I can elaborately defend in terms of who I think should be on this list or why I think the order isn't right. I think the folly is in thinking that any of these lists are definitive, rather than that a person who chooses to make a "Top Ten" has their own reasons for that list and that order and, like Kevin said, open a discussion to how the pieces could have been laid out otherwise. I'd have put Wichannoi, Karuhat, and Burklerk on there.

I'm 261 fights in and still not seeing what I do in training manifest in the ring. It takes a long time, if it happens at all. Some things will come, some will come after a long time, and some never will (I suspect), but that's okay. The way to improve "Fight IQ" is to fight more, and really more even than that is to spar as much as possible. Kevin and I call it "growing eyes," it's learning to see and feel under the pressure. You do stuff on the pads that you can't do in the context of having an opponent because padwork and "going live" (as they call it in wrestling) are totally different feelings. You stop breathing under pressure. You get tense under pressure. You try to think in a fight and nobody tries to think too much in padwork. You have to learn to feel, and feeling comes from just spending more and more time in as close to that context as possible. I have really good kicks against a bag or my trainer on pads when he's holding for them. But if I pivot off or try to kick him by surprise, my kicks go to hell. They're terribly light or weird angled. He yells at me, "just kick me hard! You won't hurt me!" So, I actually have to focus now on kicking him with the intention of hurting him, knowing that it's a problem for me. So take whatever you had in your fight, punches not being as hard, and try to bring pressure that you felt or being too far away and work on that with your trainer.

I remember Natasha Sky, who was at Sinbi at the time, said her trainers did Apple Cider Vinegar, cinnamon or cayenne pepper, and salt, then wrapped it in plastic wrap with that concoction under it. Never done that myself, but there it is. The work you're doing should be all you need to condition them for more of what you're doing, but I don't know that there's any way to "hack" the process. Obviously not recovering between is just going to be sore shins all the time, but stopping and starting is the same. Maybe use the bottom of your feet to "kick" for a bit.

This is a somewhat complicated question in that, especially in Thailand, there's a moral component to alcohol consumption that will be included in how it's viewed by your gym. Trainers who drink aren't viewed as super dependable by those who don't, students who drink are socially engaging with those trainers, but will also be dismissed in some ways by those in the gym who don't. If you're showing up and working hard, you'll be appreciated for that. If you're tired and drained - even if it's occasional - and it's known that the reason behind it is that you were out drinking, you'll be judged for that in addition to what you'd be chastised for if you were just having a "bad" day. I'm in the same school as Madeline, where I just can't afford feeling shittier than I would if it were simply a rough night of sleep or being tired from the work I'm already doing. So, I abstain for the same reasons I don't eat sugar or stay up too late to watch Netflix or whatever else. If it's compromising my training, it goes. But people have different goals and different motivations. The 5AM runs make me a total asshole for the day and I still go do those, so we all make compromises, hahaha.

Hi, "dern" is the Thai word for walking, so it means the fighter who is going forward. Sometimes the Thai commentator will be saying "Sylvie dern" and it means I'm the one coming forward, pressing the action. Clinching is allowed to go for longer out in the provinces, medium in the stadia of Bangkok, and broken stupid quickly in new 3-round formats like Max, Thai Fight, Superchamp, Hardcore, MX, etc. They claim it's to make the fights more exciting, but it makes them more boring. It only gives people time to hold, rather than work. Golden Era fights like Samson Isaan vs. Pepsi (the third one especially) or Langsuan vs Lamnamoon, the clinch goes forever and the ref just kind of keeps them off the ropes. Breaking the clinch too fast would be like separating fighters after two strikes... totally interrupts the flow of the fight. But they claim it's to make it more exciting, but really it just makes it more like a Windmill show. The way you see going forward as being positive, Thais see going backwards as being in control of the fight, rather than looking like you're scared. You can't ONLY go back. Dieselnoi often complains that all my opponents did was "nee" which is the Thai word for escaping. Going backwards for the sake of going backwards is as bad as going forward simply for the sake of going forward, it has to have meaning to how the fight is being directed by your movements. But a fighter who has the lead and then goes backwards to force the opponent to chase, or catch up, shows control of the fight. A fighter who is simply coming forward all the time looks desperate to a Thai eye, especially if they already have the lead, they look like they don't know that they're in the lead.

A lot of wrestlers stand with their strong/dominant leg forward for this same reason. Balance, better strength against takedowns. If you don't want to switch your stance, you can always "calibrate" by switching to Southpaw for a moment to do a movement and see why it's different or how it's different from when you're standing Orthodox, then make those adjustments in Orthodox. For example, I stand way more squared up in Southpaw than I do in Orthodox, so I check it in Southpaw and then go back to Orthodox and adjust so it's the same. If my kick is stronger in Southpaw, it's because my dominant leg is the standing leg, so I see where it's landing in relation to the target and then recreate that in Orthodox. I'm just entirely too "bladed" in Orthodox, should be more squared up in general, for my style. I'm not a kicker.

Thanks for this, I made a similar comment on Youtube to a comment remarking about how 3 round fight formats cannot allow longer clinch. Sure they can. It would be like separating fighters every second strike... how boring is that?

The seediness you're seeing in Pattaya is pretty well relegated to certain areas and is easy to avoid. Outside of the "red light district" areas, it's actually got quite a small-town feel. But you need a motorbike, it's not a great walking city, and there's not tons to do in terms of tourism. So your wife and son could very easily be bored. There's quite a bit of English, but not as much as in the other areas on your list. That could be good or bad, depending on what you want. Chiang Mai is a walking/bicycle city for sure. Lots to do, lots of tour packages, lots of English, etc. Probably your best bet for a train-cation. It's less expensive than any other place on your list. I've never been to Phuket, but if your wife and son love beaches that seems good. It's expensive. Bangkok has tons to do in terms of visiting temples or shopping, good public transportation, and Attachai's is pretty central in terms of being on On Nut and near a BTS station. It's less expensive than Phuket, similar to Pattaya, I imagine. Motorbike taxis are cheaper in BKK than Pattaya.

I can speak to Petchrungruang from personal experience: You get 3 rounds on the pads, 4 minutes each with 1 minute rest in between rounds. Our trainers are all pretty different from each other, some are more instructive than others, but if you prefer more instruction you can always ask. When you're not on the pads, you're largely responsible for your own work. Shadow, bagwork and conditioning are on you; you will be called in and matched up for sparring and clinching. Clinching is every day, sparring is every-other day but if you want sparring just ask for a partner or find someone you want to work with. Mornings are more quiet, generally, but it's been pretty busy in November and I expect it will stay that way through December. Mornings are a run at 5AM and then you can do your own work directly after, or you can come back at 9AM and have pads and work with everyone who comes at that time. We do a bit of "group" drills and conditioning in the morning, like groups of 3 doing 100 kicks on the bag or whatever, but in the afternoon it's less structured. Not all of our trainers speak English, but some speak it quite well. Communication is still pretty good with those who don't speak English, they can explain technique physically and generally pinpoint what the problem is without a lot of verbal necessities. Thais and westerners all train together, there's no separation in the work we do. You'll be matched in clinch and sparring based on your size and level, so that might be with a Thai or might be with another westerner. It's a family-style gym, not fussy, not fancy, but we have good equipment and it's clean. Pattaya is a mixed bag. There are distractions if you go looking for them, but it's easy enough to avoid them. There is no on-sight accommodation, but you can find your own or go with the training/accommodation package at http://royalthairesidencepattaya.com/muay-thai , which is a 15 minute walk or 5 minute motorbike ride. I love this gym. It's my home, it's my heart. But it's not for everyone and I don't universally recommend it. If you need a lot of structure, not for you. If you work hard and listen, you'll be okay.

It depends. If someone catches your kick, your kick scored already. So what they do with that can either neutralize your score or kind of get a "bonus" on top of it. If they land a strike before sweeping you, it's a big score. If they just sweep you, it could just be a neutralizing move to the score of your kick. I second what Kevin said, that you just need to have your kick caught a lot to take the fear out of it. Do it as a drill, then have your partner increase the unpredictability and pressure. The only way to stop being freaked out by something is desensitization therapy of experiencing it over and over. But start with control, then move toward more fight-real scenarios. Here's a good example from Manop: https://web.facebook.com/329140641003498/posts/526036014647292/

Welcome to the forum, Gene!

Welcome to the forum, Aurelien! Glad you've found something so fulfilling.

I get this in stretches when I'm doing a lot of jumping knees on the bag, also get it from skipping rope, etc. I get some relief from using a foam roller. I kneel on the ground with the tops of my feet against the floor, put the roller on the backs of my Achilles and then just sit on the top of the roller to create pressure. I don't move much, just leave the weight on it. I do this as a warm-up and cool-down. I also tape my ankle when the pain is a lot, as the compression seems to help. My husband is a basketball fan and loves to freak out anytime my Achilles are hurting. He has a point. It's a very common injury and he says they can just snap if you don't warm them up properly or injure them too badly. That's pretty terrifying. I do try to get them massaged when they're very painful, which in Thailand isn't expensive but massage in other parts of the world can be pretty limiting due to cost. But mine go away and I forget that they were a problem until they become a problem again.

I really appreciate you putting so much thought, consideration and time in this review. Thank you so much for that!

If you can get all the non-exciting parts sorted, like renewing your passport, buying a ticket, organizing a tourist visa and finding a gym, then for sure go. You won't regret trying the life of training and fighting in Thailand. The question isn't "should you come," it's how long you can stay. So, should you try? Yes. Are you willing to put in the work to make that happen?

It's interesting you call this "typically female behavior" but accepting the ego stroke by your coach isn't similarly called "typically male behavior." I'd call it that. Sorry you're dealing with an annoying situation and dynamic. Smart to just get away form it but shitty that you have to miss training due to it.

I don't have any resources at my disposal that aren't available through Google searches. You just have to keep looking. A lot of the information is from the Indian lineage of Rahu, much less on the Thai adaptations.

Don't decide before you get here that you can't run. Like Kero said, the pace is usually quite slow for most fighters in a gym. When we run in the morning, there's a huge gap between when the fastest runners finish and when the slowest runners catch up. It's not a race, it's what runners would call "junk miles," in that nobody cares how fast or slow you go, it's just that you're doing the work. I am 100% in the school of thought that if you don't run, you don't Muay Thai. People who argue otherwise, to me, are making excuses. When you see two fighters in the ring, you can tell with 100% accuracy, every time, who runs and who doesn't. That said, if you literally cannot run but can do something else, like skipping or jumping on the tire for ungodly amounts of time that make up for it, that's good. It's just important that you do something. But the short and blunt answer about whether you'll be looked down on by your gym for not running: yes. How much they judge you will depend on what kind of gym it is - a western-heavy gym where lots of folks don't run, not as much - as well as if you try to make up for it with something else. If you're doing other work to make up for the run, that will be acknowledged.

I'm not sure what is your question, exactly. Yes, people are afraid of him but he's a demigod and semi-demonic, so that makes sense. It's my feeling that this is a misunderstanding of his powers, but those people aren't wrong. So, walking around with that kind of thing on my chest certainly gets different reactions from people. But the only path away from ignorance is knowledge, so you just have to do as much research about him as you can in order to understand what he means to you. It sounds like you have a kind of inherent connection, which is beautiful. I have that, too. And he's not specifically villainous enough that you don't see the tattoos on fairly normal people. I've seen a number of women getting a Rahu on their lower backs in the years I've been visiting Arjan Pi, so clearly not horrific to any and all. But Arjan Pi was definitely skeptical about my Sak Yant, on my chest and in the middle of an already-not-for-women-generally Sak Yant. I think if he's tattooed on people, women especially, it's generally in a place that remains hidden by clothing.

I used to get a sore neck from punching the heavy bag, until I built up the appropriate muscles for it. It's just the strain of holding the "shields" (I say pads, sorry) and you're probably bracing hard and straining your neck. Tucking your chin will help, but in general it's matter of building up the muscles needed to prevent that kind of thing. My hips still get really sore when I decide to up my teep counts.

Wonderful, welcome Nicolas! Hope you make your goal of 2021, but be sure to let us know how your training is going in these threads in the meantime and maybe some of the advice and posts here can help you plan your trip

Tyler is right, inexpensive accommodation doesn't have cooking options. You can buy a hot-plate and a pan, which is an investment on your own part. Middle-level rooms will have a balcony with a sink where you can kind of turn it into a kitchen with a microwave and electric kettle. It's much, much easier to just buy your food from stalls but obviously the tradeoff is you don't have as much control over your diet at all. Chicken+Rice is a common meal, generally running 40 Baht for a serving. Anything that's served on rice is about 40-100 Baht, soups are about the same at most stalls. If you get a dish plus rice (not the same as "on rice"), the vegetable or meat is a bigger serving and so the price is maybe 60-120 Baht. I go to a place near the gym that's grilled chicken and Somtum (spicy salad). A whole chicken plus the salad is 199 Baht and it takes me two meals to finish the chicken. If you sit down at an indoor restaurant with air-con, food prices are around 120-250 Baht per dish. If you get western food, it's 200+ for almost anything. Cheap rooms can be as low as 2500 Baht per month (for any price I give, water and electricity are not included), but usually they don't have air-con or hot water. 5000/month is the lowest I've seen for having air-con and hot water, but the room will be small and often there's a 6 month contract on those. We did this in Bangkok our first trip out and just paid the penalty for canceling the contract before 6 months, which was the cost of our deposit (1 month's rent). I recommend a motorbike in Pattaya, those are probably 1500 Baht for a month, plus whatever gas cost to fill it, which depends on how much you drive. I drive a lot and it's probably 120 Baht/week in gas. Otherwise you can walk and use the truck-busses or motorbike taxis for longer trips. I'll try to add more to this as I think of things. But ask if I've missed something and I'll try to find out.

I totally feel that destructive, super-passionate relationship thing. The way the very same thing that builds you up and makes you feel AMAZING, also tears you apart and makes you question everything you are. But the good times are sooo good, it makes you think the bad times are worth it. Basically, find something you love and let it destroy you. But not in the abusive relationship way, in the "you cannot possibly remain the same person through this process" kind of way. Destroyed and rebuilt, all the time. All the time. I've never thrown myself into anything the way I've been consumed by Muay Thai. Not only is it my whole life, it's Kevin's whole life, too. Maybe it's not possible to answer "why" you're obsessed by something, because the answer is always the same, that you're just fascinated and enamored and it never dries up. I can't picture myself doing anything else. The frequently asked question of "what are you going to do when you stop fighting?" is fucking heart-breaking. It would be like meeting someone's dog or husband and asking them what they're going to do when the thing they love the most dies. I don't know... feels like the end of the world.

I'm fighting tonight, Wednesday the 28th, in Chiang Mai. I don't know where I am on the card yet, but probably around 10:30 PM Thai Time I should be in the ring