Learning clinch, based on patreon Muay Thai Library content

[Thomas V]

Yesterday, I sent the following message directly to Sylvie.
While the question was originally meant for her, I'd appreciate other people's insights as well.

--- actual message ---

I have been casually (1 or 2 classes per week) training Muay thai near my home in Belgium for about a year.
The classes are great, but there is little to no clinching.
The main reason is that the gym's head trainer has very little clinching experience.

As I'd really like to get into clinching, I am going to take some privates with another trainer at the gym.
Apparently he has some clinching experience, and his knowledge is probably adequate for learning the basics like posture, balance, swimming in, same basic positions and their counters.

Having watched most of your content on Patreon, (your videos with Yodkhunpon are especially awesome), there are a few things I want to integrate into my clinching sessions from the beginning.
1. Playing around with the clinch, not just doing drills
2. Building a frame (You explained it quite well in a video where you're teaching it to your friend Kate)
3. learning some extremely dominant positions to work towards.

Looking through your Patreon content, the following positions stood out to me:
1. The basic lock you learned from Bank (Seems like a strong basic position to learn, and useful to progress to even better positions)
2. Satanmuanglek's Lock, using shoulder pressure under the chin (Seems like a direct upgrade to Bank's lock, if you can manage to get to it)
3. Tanadet's long clinch (Looks like it's very powerful once you get the hang of it, and can relax in the position the way Tanadet does)
4. Rambaa's arm lock (Seems like a guaranteed win, if you can get into this position)

A few other positions I'd like to look into in the long term are:
Yodkhunpon's standard clinch position (1 hand controlling the neck/head, the other resting on the opposite bicep/shoulder, ready to elbow)
Dieselnoi's favorite head lock: 2 hands on the back of the opponents head, and kneeing until your opponent collapses

These last two look great in your video's, but I suspect they're more dependent on the specific style of striking of the fighter to be successful.

Do you think the overall approach I describe above is a good way to go about learning clinch? Do you think the dominant positions I described are a good collection to look into, or would you add some more / leave a few out?
I'd appreciate any advise you can give me.

Thomas

[Jeremy Stewart]

21 hours ago, Thomas V said:

Yesterday, I sent the following message directly to Sylvie.
While the question was originally meant for her, I'd appreciate other people's insights as well.

--- actual message ---

I have been casually (1 or 2 classes per week) training Muay thai near my home in Belgium for about a year.
The classes are great, but there is little to no clinching.
The main reason is that the gym's head trainer has very little clinching experience.

As I'd really like to get into clinching, I am going to take some privates with another trainer at the gym.
Apparently he has some clinching experience, and his knowledge is probably adequate for learning the basics like posture, balance, swimming in, same basic positions and their counters.

Having watched most of your content on Patreon, (your videos with Yodkhunpon are especially awesome), there are a few things I want to integrate into my clinching sessions from the beginning.
1. Playing around with the clinch, not just doing drills
2. Building a frame (You explained it quite well in a video where you're teaching it to your friend Kate)
3. learning some extremely dominant positions to work towards.

Looking through your Patreon content, the following positions stood out to me:
1. The basic lock you learned from Bank (Seems like a strong basic position to learn, and useful to progress to even better positions)
2. Satanmuanglek's Lock, using shoulder pressure under the chin (Seems like a direct upgrade to Bank's lock, if you can manage to get to it)
3. Tanadet's long clinch (Looks like it's very powerful once you get the hang of it, and can relax in the position the way Tanadet does)
4. Rambaa's arm lock (Seems like a guaranteed win, if you can get into this position)

A few other positions I'd like to look into in the long term are:
Yodkhunpon's standard clinch position (1 hand controlling the neck/head, the other resting on the opposite bicep/shoulder, ready to elbow)
Dieselnoi's favorite head lock: 2 hands on the back of the opponents head, and kneeing until your opponent collapses

These last two look great in your video's, but I suspect they're more dependent on the specific style of striking of the fighter to be successful.

Do you think the overall approach I describe above is a good way to go about learning clinch? Do you think the dominant positions I described are a good collection to look into, or would you add some more / leave a few out?
I'd appreciate any advise you can give me.

Thomas

Don't  be shy to just play around with stuff. Clinching in my opinion is about feeling and being relaxed in what you're doing. I personally enjoy it but a lot of people don't because they don't understand the nuances of it. So just give it a go with your mate.

[Sylvie von Duuglas-Ittu]

Wow, you've got a really nice game plan with tons of great reference to work from. Thanks for watching the content so closely! The thing about locks is that you want them to be resting positions, more or less. The frame is to control your opponent, to keep them from locking you, to move them and turn for a knee, but then you move into a lock position to kind of "slow down." Dieselnoi, when he has that horrible double lock and he's wrenching his opponent's heads around, he's resting. Slowing down a bit to catch his own breath while off-balancing his opponent and, through the discomfort and control, keep them from breathing. Yodkhunpon's hold, with the hand on the bicep, that's a waiting game. He's anticipating the knee so that he can elbow or turn. Also a kind of "slowed down" moment.

So moving into locks, or between locks, you want to see them as like the stones in a river that you can hop onto for a moment to make a plan. You don't stay there. That's not your end game. It's transitional, although you don't have to move off your spot too fast. So, when you're working on those different locks, shoulders from Satanmuanglek and head from Tanadet's long clinch, work on them by getting into and out of them. Make it a "full range of motion" practice, instead of a drill. To feel the edges, how to move in and through them. 

I also advise you to take a look at Burklerk and Silapathai, who both love to snuff the clinch because they don't like to be in the clinch. If you're really into learning to clinch, learn how to get out of it, too. Because people will use those tricks against you, but it also allows you to move a lot more than if you only learn the dominant positions. In those two examples, Burklerk is showing how to stop someone from being able to grab you - nearly at all - with the way he locks out the shoulders; this also works great for killing punchers and elbows. And Silapathai's version is slithering out of the way with great turns - Karuhat does this, too - which allows you to change position quickly and get your own lock, if you're actually trying to clinch.

[Kevin von Duuglas-Ittu]

For reference to others interested in this question, here are some of the materials cited:

#59  Satanmuanglek Numpornthep - Beautiful Clinch Throws (65 min) watch it here 

#15 Yodkhunpon "The Elbow Hunter" part 2 - Escapes  (48 min) watch it here

#56 Tanadet Tor. Pran49 - Mastering Long Clinch (63 min) watch it here 

Bonus Session:  The Importance of Building a Frame | 32 min - watch it here

#10 The Clinch Techniques of Yodwicha - Session 2 (34 min) watch it here 

#4 Yodwicha - Clinch and Muay Khao (Knee) Specialist (35 min) - watch it here 

#21 Rambaa Somdet - Clinch Trips & Throws (34 min) watch it here

And the Bank Lock Sylvie's Tips: