The Future of Muay Thai
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By Kevin von Duuglas-Ittu · Posted
I suspect that if we took on a Bataille perspective we would much better understand the manner in which Westerners (and those of other parts of the world) come to Thailand to train, often quite rigorously and with great passion. They are looking for a way to expend themselves, in almost a bonfire sense, to undergo and profusely endure an expense, along the order of some kind of transformation. I think though, along with Bataille, we should not look to what they are trying to expend themselves FOR, or what skills or qualities they are looking to attain. There are those kinds of descriptions of reasons available to us, but I suspect that the impulse lies much deeper than this, in the sense of turbulence that Bataille identifies, which MUST be expended, if it is to not become war-like and aggression prone. In this sense many Westerners come balanced on a knife's edge needing the sense of expenditure, in the gift-like manner of surrendering oneself over, into that which one could not partake, but is also confined by the bellicose picture of fighting arts themselves, the idea that fighting, that Muay Thai, is of the more aggressive, hostile affects of the soul, that is a kind of making-war. What they encounter in Thailand though is the second half, the other branch, the branch of festival and shine, which turns away from the urge to make war, to expend oneself in war. To waste in war. Instead it is a wasting that leans towards the solar and the shine. But, this alien reaction to turbulence of the pent-up, the unexpended, hoarded energy is not easy to digest, to even understand. It can take many, many years before one enjoys the role of expense itself, the wasteful portion that does not belong to you, that is merely Gift. Through fighting though (festival) and through daily gym celebrations of expenditure, one can come to it. -
By Kevin von Duuglas-Ittu · Posted
Yodkhunpon visits PK Saenchai every Thursday, so you could be connected to him there, but I suspect the work you could do with him is much more thorough in private sessions in Pattaya, where he lives. Clinch is gyms is very hard to assess, because opportunity can depend on what size you are. If you are large bodied probably clinching with other Westerners would be what you require (but you'll not be training as much against skilled Thais, who know the art at a deeper level, which is important because a lot of clinch learning is through osmosis). We haven't been up to the (new) Lanna yet, but it does seem fighter-centric. -
By Kevin von Duuglas-Ittu · Posted
Solarity, Bataille and Efficiency Thinking about Bataille today, and his advisement that our problem is not that we cannot use, save, do efficiently, its that we no longer know how to expend. How to burn, shine, profusion ourselves in waste we can never use. Thinking about what this means for ideas how efficiency in Muay Thai, but also in traditional Muay Thai itself. In the mechanistic West we definitely have a hack mentality of efficiency, a "train smarter not harder" ethos which in some sort of Sport Science manner reflects (distorts) deeper pictures of fighter efficiency. When we see in the ring the movement of greats we see that there is no wasted movement, an ease and naturalness (that ironically enough cannot be attained through the kinds of mechanistic hacks of efficiency and purposed functional movement science, which mirror the notion...one cannot build "natural" out of lego parts and gearworks). What does a Bataille notion of excess and expenditure say to these very prime ideas of stripping away the excess, to fall into conditions where nothing is "wasted"? The first insight might be found in his questioning of the very idea of "use". He is already criticizing a "systems" sort of thinking (economics, but really a larger ideology) which isolates a structure from its environment, and seeks to strengthen it, grow it, empower it. This aspect of "use" value means that anything that adds to this growth, this power, necessarily is a utility, it has a purpose. His critique is that this is a false picture. Yes, you can grow and strengthen, develop all sorts of capacities, as a fighter assortments of techniques, physical patterns and extensions, but Bataille will tell you there is a limit in this. That at a certain point the challenge is not in building oneself out, but in expending oneself, and if you don't address this there will be problems. In his work The Accursed Share he poses two possibilities (speaking of social structure), that of festival and potlach, immense public displays and donations of wealth for others, immense gifting...or, atrocities of war, which are also expenditures of great waste (even if they have reasons behind them, giving them purpose). This comes from a turbulence that develops once one has built out capacities, once one has grown. For those that picture fighting to have something to do with War, one could imagine that fighting (and even for some, sparring) is exactly that kind of expenditure, that kind of "waste" without use that comes out of built-out turbulence, as it engages in the hotter emotions, aggression and anger, releasing (spending) the pent up, and this could be so. But It is worth thinking about how Thailand's traditional Muay Thai is born from the festival tradition of the countryside, the rings of gambling and communal expenditure as Gift. It is born - and renewed - out of the splendor of expense which folds in the public, and this gives clue to the kinds of expenditure that come out of the great, acme examples of Thai fighters, the unique way that they shine. It is that they have become, in all their training, all their fighting, an immense profusion, a festival expenditure of the Self, which is not for the self, which is not of "use" or made efficient, what Bataille would likely qualify as a solarity. As techniques are traced from the great fighters and their fights, and even their instruction, and placed in regimes of efficiency, to be replicated in innumerable copies I cannot help but think about what it is like to be space with legends of the sport and to feel how they move, how much it is made of this kind of profusion, a shining out, which does not come from usefulness or utility or even efficiency (as an end). There is an excess that comes off their aura that defies utility itself, that comes off as Gift for the eyes, and for our sense of self...for us.
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By Snack Payback · Posted
I can only comment on Perth. There's a very active Muay Thai scene here - regular shows. Plenty of gyms across the city with Thai trainers. All gyms offer trial classes so you can try a few out before committing . Direct flights to Bangkok and Phuket as well. Would you be coming over on a working holiday visa? Loads of work around Western Australia at the moment. -
By kkadzielna · Posted
Hi, I'm considering moving to Australia from the UK and I'm curious what is the scene like? Is it easy to fight frequently (proam/pro level), especially as a female? How does it compare to the UK? Any gym recommendations? I'll be grateful for any insights. -
By kkadzielna · Posted
You won't find thai style camps in Europe, because very few people can actually fight full time, especially in muay thai. As a pro you just train at a regular gym, mornings and evenings, sometimes daytime if you don't have a job or one that allows it. Best you can hope for is a gym with pro fighters in it and maybe some structured invite-only fighters classes. Even that is a big ask, most of Europe is gonna be k1 rather than muay thai. A lot of gyms claim to offer muay thai, but in reality only teach kickboxing. I think Sweden has some muay thai gyms and shows, but it seems to be an exception. I'm interested in finding a high-level muay thai gym in Europe myself, I want to go back, but it seems to me that for as long as I want to fight I'm stuck in the UK, unless I switch to k1 or MMA which I don't want to do. -
Hi all, Does anyone know of any suppliers for blanks (Plain items to design and print a logo on) that are a good quality? Or put me in the right direction? thanks all -
The first fight between Poot Lorlek and Posai Sittiboonlert was recently uploaded to youtube. Posai is one of the earliest great Muay Khao fighters and influential to Dieselnoi, but there's very little footage of him. Poot is one of the GOATs and one of Posai's best wins, it's really cool to see how Posai's style looked against another elite fighter.
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